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Thread: CAT Light weight power option

  1. #1
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    CAT Light weight power option

    So math electrical wizzes will this work for a ceremony? Say, a laptop for the music, K10 speaker and a wireless mic running through it. How long do you feel it will hold up before dying? It's only 200 watts of AC power, 2 amp USB.


    Cat Professional 1000 Peak Amp Jump Starter
    Heavy weight lifter, karate, oh, I DJ too. Life is good!

  2. #2
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    Not sure, but the battery is shown as 19Ah @ 12v, which is 1.9Ah @ 120v (assuming no loss). I would assume a K10 will pull maybe .5A when not pushed, so maybe you'd get 2-3 hours .. less at higher volumes.
    Steve Montambault, Copper Sound
    Audio - Rane MP25, A&H ZED12FX, Denon MC6000mk2, Denon DN-HC4500, JBL PRX612m, Yamaha DXS12, RCF EVOX 8

  3. #3
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    It's the just arrived CAT Model CJ1000CP at Costco and only $79.99. If it remains stable for 2 hours or more this may be a sweet unit to have for an outdoor ceremony or cocktail hour???
    Heavy weight lifter, karate, oh, I DJ too. Life is good!

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockingdj View Post
    It's the just arrived CAT Model CJ1000CP at Costco and only $79.99. If it remains stable for 2 hours or more this may be a sweet unit to have for an outdoor ceremony or cocktail hour???
    Possible .. it appears similar in concept to the Black&Decker units people have used. Buy one, charge it, run a phone to the K and see if it makes 2 hours .. if not, return it.
    Steve Montambault, Copper Sound
    Audio - Rane MP25, A&H ZED12FX, Denon MC6000mk2, Denon DN-HC4500, JBL PRX612m, Yamaha DXS12, RCF EVOX 8

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve149 View Post
    Possible .. it appears similar in concept to the Black&Decker units people have used. Buy one, charge it, run a phone to the K and see if it makes 2 hours .. if not, return it.
    I hear ya' but I don't like buying things with the intent to return. Guess that's why I have way too much gear.
    Heavy weight lifter, karate, oh, I DJ too. Life is good!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockingdj View Post
    I hear ya' but I don't like buying things with the intent to return. Guess that's why I have way too much gear.
    OK .. then it's only a $80 experiment and tax write-off. Some cables are more expensive.
    Steve Montambault, Copper Sound
    Audio - Rane MP25, A&H ZED12FX, Denon MC6000mk2, Denon DN-HC4500, JBL PRX612m, Yamaha DXS12, RCF EVOX 8

  7. #7
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    I see a few different ones listed online, Costco specs their stuff different than Home Depot etc.
    The one I am looking at based off your model has the following specs:
    500w Amp Instant, 1000w Peak - for Jump Starting
    200w Power Station for charging or whatever

    According to QSC
    A K10 at 1/8 power uses 2.3Amps @ 100 VAC or 2.01Amps at 2.01VAC
    http://www.qsc.com/live-sound/produc.../k-series/k10/

    Oversimplified Calculation of 'Apparent' Power:
    Amps*Volts=Watts
    So the consumption of the K10 alone would potentially be 230-241 watts putting you over the Power Station Limit right there.

    That being said, there are other factors that knock down this number from what the label says. The K10 does use a class D amplifier, so it is possible to get way less of a draw making it possible to get them powered on as many reports of actual power draw are closer to .5a or .6a.

    That aside, there's more than just the numbers to consider. I am going to assume you are considering this just to use the internal battery and not use some sort of inverter feature off a deep cycle battery.

    1. At that price (~80), I doubt you are getting a clean sine wave from the DC to AC converter. It's going to be some modified/trimmed/squared off signal that could potentially shorten the life of your K10s. Quality inverters that will do the job start at around double what this cost.
    2. Peaks/Spikes needed in power can easily trip something even if you can get it started and 'kind of working'. I have a 2000w generator which has brownouts at higher volumes when connected up to the equipment.
    3. The unit is designed for short bursts of high power or trickles to charge household items, I would not trust it for a professional application as it may not have the mechanisms in place to deal with heat dissipation etc.

    Side note: While it was not the same brand or model, I used something similar to attempt to power a pump to get standing water off my boat cover in storage. It didn't work. I tried to jump my boat off it - still didn't work. If it couldn't power a small pump for 2 minutes, I wouldn't have any confidence in it moving a woofer for 2 hours.

    My advice: Save your money and get a high quality inverter with a deep cycle battery, or a quiet inverter generator, or a decent set of battery powered speakers. Unless you have some great protection plan, replacing a K10 sounds just as expensive.

  8. #8
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    Get a high quality inverter with a deep cycle battery, or a quiet inverter generator, or a decent set of battery powered speakers. Unless you have some great protection plan, replacing a K10 sounds just as expensive.

    I am open to some suggested Brands/Model Numbers/Links to what Costco, Home Depot, or Lowe's or elsewhere may carry that would work well. Looking to replace the heftier but not too bad weight wise Honda 2000i.

    Have several in the woods weddings coming up in later 2017. No power there.
    Heavy weight lifter, karate, oh, I DJ too. Life is good!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Camarofleet View Post
    I see a few different ones listed online, Costco specs their stuff different than Home Depot etc.
    The one I am looking at based off your model has the following specs:
    500w Amp Instant, 1000w Peak - for Jump Starting
    200w Power Station for charging or whatever

    According to QSC
    A K10 at 1/8 power uses 2.3Amps @ 100 VAC or 2.01Amps at 2.01VAC
    http://www.qsc.com/live-sound/produc.../k-series/k10/

    Oversimplified Calculation of 'Apparent' Power:
    Amps*Volts=Watts
    So the consumption of the K10 alone would potentially be 230-241 watts putting you over the Power Station Limit right there.

    That being said, there are other factors that knock down this number from what the label says. The K10 does use a class D amplifier, so it is possible to get way less of a draw making it possible to get them powered on as many reports of actual power draw are closer to .5a or .6a.

    That aside, there's more than just the numbers to consider. I am going to assume you are considering this just to use the internal battery and not use some sort of inverter feature off a deep cycle battery.

    1. At that price (~80), I doubt you are getting a clean sine wave from the DC to AC converter. It's going to be some modified/trimmed/squared off signal that could potentially shorten the life of your K10s. Quality inverters that will do the job start at around double what this cost.
    2. Peaks/Spikes needed in power can easily trip something even if you can get it started and 'kind of working'. I have a 2000w generator which has brownouts at higher volumes when connected up to the equipment.
    3. The unit is designed for short bursts of high power or trickles to charge household items, I would not trust it for a professional application as it may not have the mechanisms in place to deal with heat dissipation etc.

    Side note: While it was not the same brand or model, I used something similar to attempt to power a pump to get standing water off my boat cover in storage. It didn't work. I tried to jump my boat off it - still didn't work. If it couldn't power a small pump for 2 minutes, I wouldn't have any confidence in it moving a woofer for 2 hours.

    My advice: Save your money and get a high quality inverter with a deep cycle battery, or a quiet inverter generator, or a decent set of battery powered speakers. Unless you have some great protection plan, replacing a K10 sounds just as expensive.
    I ran 2 Yorkville Unity tops/subs (3 QSC PLX2 amps), mixing console, floor monitors and a few other pieces and drew only 8 amps covering 400+ people. I would suspect that for a ceremony, the K10 draw is 1 amp or less.
    Steve Montambault, Copper Sound
    Audio - Rane MP25, A&H ZED12FX, Denon MC6000mk2, Denon DN-HC4500, JBL PRX612m, Yamaha DXS12, RCF EVOX 8

  10. #10
    Try xantrex pure sine wave power inverters.
    http://www.xantrex.com/power-product.../overview.aspx

    I think i heard about them on this very site. I got the 1000 watt one and it works well for me with a marine battery. I did have it once cut out after i plugged in my bass adding to the band. It was post recessional so no disaster. Maybe my battery wasnt big enough or perhaps the 2000 watt one would be better. Works great for ceremonies and once i used it to get power to my older wired uplights ro light up trees outdoors at night (ahh, the PNW in the summer...)

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockingdj View Post
    Get a high quality inverter with a deep cycle battery, or a quiet inverter generator, or a decent set of battery powered speakers. Unless you have some great protection plan, replacing a K10 sounds just as expensive.

    I am open to some suggested Brands/Model Numbers/Links to what Costco, Home Depot, or Lowe's or elsewhere may carry that would work well. Looking to replace the heftier but not too bad weight wise Honda 2000i.

    Have several in the woods weddings coming up in later 2017. No power there.
    Ha! Had you not said that I was going to suggest a 2000i!

    Perhaps something like this:
    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Power-Bri...0-12/202545834

    Or this (which actually has a review from a Dj):
    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Power-Bri...0-12/202543465

    As far as battery a deep cycle boat or RV battery from West Marine/Sams Club/Costco should be just fine. Most batteries are manufactured by Johnson Controls and re-badged anymore, but mine are Crown and Energizer brand and have served me well - I have had bad luck with the life span on Interstate and Autozone/Duralast brands if depleted and recharged more than average.

    Personally, I don't have any experience with the inverters above, but I would try one of those if I was in the market. I have cheaper ones, when I use them I am running my old 'crap' equipment off them carefully with a power conditioner with voltage readout so I really don't care if I'm shortening the life. I use them more for powering accessories and use dedicated battery powered speakers.

    This is similar to the Anchor system I use speaker-wise for no-power remote stuff - I can get over 6-8 hours off these, great for speech and ceremony stuff/cocktails - not great for high volumes and begin to distort at about 2/3 power with 'dance' type music, but I have done full receptions in the middle of public parks with no power with them - I probably wouldn't for a reception of over 30 people:

    https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...aYCsQ&c3nid=98

    If I were in the market, I would probably get one of the new Denon or Galaxy portable PAs and call it a day.

  12. #12
    My money is on more extension cords.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proformance View Post
    My money is on more extension cords.
    Sure you do when the closet plug-in is 1000 or more feet away. You must like to Rap cords, no pun intended. And have weak power/voltage.
    Heavy weight lifter, karate, oh, I DJ too. Life is good!

  14. #14
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    You can also try this option from Harbor Freight Tools for $499.99:

    http://www.harborfreight.com/engines...arb-62523.html

    If you are member of their mailing list, then you can get even deeper discounts with coupons.

    This is supposedly comparable to the Honda EU2000i. I haven't tried it yet. I am considering a purchase later this month.

    JOE A. DELFIN (JAMMIN'DOWN JD)
    Entertainment Director and Broadcast Consultant
    ULTRA EVENTS CHICAGO
    (events@ultraevents.com)
    2015-16 Vice President - American Disc Jockey Association, Chicago Chapter (2015 Chapter of the Year)


  15. #15
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    Otherwise, I use two Duracell PowerPack Pro 1300 small-size inverters. I have run at least 2 hours on them (though after an hour, I felt more and more anxious). I used one with 2 QSC K10s, a live sound mixer, and a wireless microphone receiver for an outdoor event. They may not be as reliable as a gas generator like the Honda EU2000i and similar gas generator/inverters. Looking back, I would have invested in a Honda EU2000i instead of the two Duracell PowerPack Pros.

    https://www.amazon.com/Duracell-DR60.../dp/B009YR00MI

    JOE A. DELFIN (JAMMIN'DOWN JD)
    Entertainment Director and Broadcast Consultant
    ULTRA EVENTS CHICAGO
    (events@ultraevents.com)
    2015-16 Vice President - American Disc Jockey Association, Chicago Chapter (2015 Chapter of the Year)


  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by rockingdj View Post
    Sure you do when the closet plug-in is 1000 or more feet away. You must like to Rap cords, no pun intended. And have weak power/voltage.
    Silly rabbit, the generator is screened only 50 yards away.

    It takes a minimum of 800 watts of continuous duty power to securely run a small ceremony system. That's easily done with a small portable generator, many of which are fairly quiet, and not much larger than a heavy duty fog machine. Properly screened to reflect noise away from your direction they become unnoticeable.

    If you are running multiple speakers while on generator power it may be more electrically efficient to run a passive system from a single amplifier than to power up multiple under-utilized amps of individual active speakers.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamminDownJD View Post
    You can also try this option from Harbor Freight Tools for $499.99:

    http://www.harborfreight.com/engines...arb-62523.html

    If you are member of their mailing list, then you can get even deeper discounts with coupons.

    This is supposedly comparable to the Honda EU2000i. I haven't tried it yet. I am considering a purchase later this month.
    After you get it and try it let us know the outcome on how well it works and how quiet it is. Thanks!
    Heavy weight lifter, karate, oh, I DJ too. Life is good!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proformance View Post
    Silly rabbit, the generator is screened only 50 yards away.

    It takes a minimum of 800 watts of continuous duty power to securely run a small ceremony system. That's easily done with a small portable generator, many of which are fairly quiet, and not much larger than a heavy duty fog machine. Properly screened to reflect noise away from your direction they become unnoticeable.

    If you are running multiple speakers while on generator power it may be more electrically efficient to run a passive system from a single amplifier than to power up multiple under-utilized amps of individual active speakers.
    I'm not a silly rabbit . Being a rabbit as you say, I'm going to follow you around and chew on your cords. Bullet proof vest on. I'll leave some droppings too so you know it was me. Enjoy.

    So list your generator picks.
    Heavy weight lifter, karate, oh, I DJ too. Life is good!

  19. #19
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    Most contractors will tell you if life, limb or livelihood depends on it, or unless it is one of their 'Diamond In The Rough' heavily reviewed buys to stay away from HFT.

    By the time you're in $500 deep, it's only a stone throws away to get something a little more reliable such as a Generac, Rigid or Honda.

    That being said, I have nothing against off brands and I often times use them. For example, I have a Black Maxx Generator (Often found at Sams Club). However, I believe mine has either a Briggs and Stratton or Honda Engine which to me was indicative of quality parts. A generator is really just an engine spinning a motor and then converting the energy to electrical current, so there's really not much to them. Of course I also use Power Conditioner/Surge Protector and other protective gear in line with it.

    What scares me about the HFT/Predator stuff, is I believe a lot of the unit is pieced out of their in-house brands. I am not sure of the origin of any of the components or if the components are truly made in the same plants other manufacturers are using. They could be, but it would take some research to uncover it.

    Trusting this generator would be the equivalent of trusting Pyle Pro powered speakers to do your event. Will it work? Probably. Is it going to be as nice? Probably Not. Will it break? Maybe. Is it truly 'Pro' quality? Meh.

    Personally, would I associate my companies reputation on it? No.

  20. #20
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    Haha... I decided not to pick up the Harbor Freight inverter/generator. Gotta save up for either the new Denon SC-5000 Prime decks or RCF EVOX speakers! The inverter is low on my priorities, especially since I have the Duracell Powerpack Pros anyway.

    JOE A. DELFIN (JAMMIN'DOWN JD)
    Entertainment Director and Broadcast Consultant
    ULTRA EVENTS CHICAGO
    (events@ultraevents.com)
    2015-16 Vice President - American Disc Jockey Association, Chicago Chapter (2015 Chapter of the Year)


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